Chicago won a cup after the Kane and Toews contracts

Players who want to win will take a slight discount to play for a contender like the Oil will be. McDavid will get paid that money either in Edmonton or somewhere else and there is no way Edmonton will ever get a fair deal in a trade for arguably the second best player and soon to be best player in the league. So they can either pay him or watch him get paid somewhere else and they're making the right call
- bulet13

I hear you. The point i am making is, to win a cup it takes a team, not just a superstar player.

Chicago also benefited greatly from the Hossa and Keith deals. Edmonton wont have that luxury.

Wouldn't it make more sense to just remove their teeth?
- BiggE

with a hammer?

hopefully, a more skilled 4th line can also create more 5 on 5 chances\scoring.
- ggunky

I meant to quote this earlier but got tied up...since then you and BiggE have both said additional comments that fit this scenario regarding depth/production

One of the weaknesses of the Flyers the last 3-4 years has been how top heavy they were on offense. They constantly relied on one or two lines to score. It is one of the reasons they also had to rely on the PP, because they lacked an advantage during 5v5 play. We cannot forget this when evaluating what will happen next year and the future.

The way this offseason has unfolded, it is virtually impossible for them to put together a "defense" line and we should see an increase in the overall skill level of the depth forwards. They're moving away from being a team with a few good scorers to a team with solid depth and 4 lines to outmatch opponents. We are finally getting our wish. Hockey is about exploiting weaknesses. The youth may have have some bumps along the way, but it is all building to a complete team with fewer weaknesses.

This isn't true.

The cap not going up is what hurt Chicago. When they signed Toews and Kane to the contracts they did they did it with the thought that the cap would increase every year. It didn't and they have suffered greatly from it.
- ggunky

"Since the NHL salary cap was reintroduced following the ratification of the current collective bargaining agreement, it has risen every year since being instituted"

Crosby took a serious home town discount on his last contract. Let's not even joke about that. He could have gotten way more money someplace else and we all know it.
- FlyersGrace

He sure did.

I hear you. The point i am making is, to win a cup it takes a team, not just a superstar player.

Chicago also benefited greatly from the Hossa and Keith deals. Edmonton wont have that luxury.
- ggunky

Edmonton knows their window is in the next few years. More than any McDavid contract its really the ridiculous Lucic contract that is hampering them

Andrew MacDonald, lefty:

3 years remaining at 5mAAV; owed $16.5 million.

Jason Demers, righty:

4 years remaining at 4.5mAAV; owed 17 million.

How do we meme this trade into existence?
- mochoson

Would love that.

the cap has increased every year dude seriously try using google

i would post an image but im bad at computers and internet
- bulet13

Ok, i mispoke. It hasn't gone up at the rate that was expected.

Edit:

As much as Chicago and most every other team expected.

Wouldn't it make more sense to just remove their teeth?
- BiggE

Ok, i mispoke. It hasn't gone up at the rate that was expected.

Edit:

As much as Chicago and most every other team expected.
- ggunky

I think that was only this year and last and that was mainly due to a weakening Canadian dollar

Its increased by 10 million in 4 years, which isn't nothing

Would love that.
- YuenglingJagr

Seriously, why hasn't Hexy dont it yet? Both players are the same age and have pretty much identical contracts commitment wise. Panthers didn't protect Demers and were trying to trade him around the expansion draft.

Florida saves 500k in actual $, big for a team with an internal budget. The extra 500k in cap hit is negligible as they never approach the ceiling. MacDonald's contract is also a year shorter in commitment, and he is a lefty. Right now, they already have 3 right handed D with Ekblad, Pysyk, Petrovic.

Philly gets a righty that they desperately need and another 500k in cap space. Demers deal is also front loaded, unlike AMac's. So if 2-3 years from now if we need to buy-out or move Demers again, it shouldn't be difficult at all to do.

Demers is a better player than AndyMac, but by how much? I'd be willing to throw in a pick or a prospect to do it (3rd/4th round pick or a guy like Fazleev?), but nothing crazy. This trade just makes to much sense to me.

You'd like to think so. Patrick and Lindblom haven't played an NHL game yet. No one has any idea what they will add scoring wise. There just isn't a way to estimate. Is it a lock these guys make the roster? Who knows.
- PLindbergh31

everyone female doges and moans about wanting to see the kids and now that we are going to see the kids you are STILL finding a negative. we have been saying we need more high end talent and we got the 2nd pick in the draft and you are still finding a negative. we all complain about the Flyers' old way, while providing fun runs for the most part, but still not producing a championship so they bring in someone who spent time on the outside in Hextall (which people also female doged about the same old same old) who wants to change the way the team operates and you still find a negative. Yes there are still holes and no GM is perfect but Hextall has been reshaping this team and that takes time.

I mean, its this all just trolling for you?

there's also an escalator clause thats kicked in every year since the new CBA
- bulet13

There has also reportedly been growing resistance to using a significant percent of the escalator clause due to the amount of player's money held in escrow as a result.

Putting more money in escrow to artificially inflate the cap results in a better market for free agents in that given year, but then when revenues don't grow a ton every player actually makes less money due to escrow going to the team owners.

The point is that GMs seemed to be operating under the assumption 4 and 5 years ago that the cap would consistently rise 4-ish million every year, and now its been more like 2.5ish million, which has mainly just been an artificial rise thanks to the players union using the escalator clause.

Seriously, why hasn't Hexy dont it yet? Both players are the same age and have pretty much identical contracts commitment wise. Panthers didn't protect Demers and were trying to trade him around the expansion draft.

Florida saves 500k in actual $, big for a team with an internal budget. The extra 500k in cap hit is negligible as they never approach the ceiling. MacDonald's contract is also a year shorter in commitment, and he is a lefty. Right now, they already have 3 right handed D with Ekblad, Pysyk, Petrovic.

Philly gets a righty that they desperately need and another 500k in cap space. Demers deal is also front loaded, unlike AMac's. So if 2-3 years from now if we need to buy-out or move Demers again, it shouldn't be difficult at all to do.

Demers is a better player than AndyMac, but by how much? I'd be willing to throw in a pick or a prospect to do it (3rd/4th round pick or a guy like Fazleev?), but nothing crazy. This trade just makes to much sense to me.
- mochoson

Hagg-Provorov
Ghost-Gudas
Morin-Demers
-Manning

Pleaseeee Hexy for the love of God it's perfect please make it happen.

Crosby took a serious home town discount on his last contract. Let's not even joke about that. He could have gotten way more money someplace else and we all know it.
- FlyersGrace

hate the guy cause he is a penguin but honestly I respect his desire to win

with a hammer?
- FlyersGrace

Hammer, pliers, sawed off shotgun...whatever floats your boat

I meant to quote this earlier but got tied up...since then you and BiggE have both said additional comments that fit this scenario regarding depth/production

One of the weaknesses of the Flyers the last 3-4 years has been how top heavy they were on offense. They constantly relied on one or two lines to score. It is one of the reasons they also had to rely on the PP, because they lacked an advantage during 5v5 play. We cannot forget this when evaluating what will happen next year and the future.

The way this offseason has unfolded, it is virtually impossible for them to put together a "defense" line and we should see an increase in the overall skill level of the depth forwards. They're moving away from being a team with a few good scorers to a team with solid depth and 4 lines to outmatch opponents. We are finally getting our wish. Hockey is about exploiting weaknesses. The youth may have have some bumps along the way, but it is all building to a complete team with fewer weaknesses.
- YuenglingJagr

I'm just wondering if the offense will resemble Nashville with a lot of initiation from the dmen. Kind of hard generate offense with slow skaters like Schultz and Streit, or passive dman like AMAC. I'm really looking forward to training camp to see how the blue line shakes out and who is the top 6.

Hagg-Provorov
Ghost-Gudas
Morin-Demers
-Manning

Pleaseeee Hexy for the love of God it's perfect please make it happen.
- mochoson

Like the 6, but there is no way I'm putting Hagg on the top pair at this point in his career, maybe someday, but not now. I'd go with:
Provorov-Gudas
Morin-Ghost
Hagg-Demers

the bottom 2 pairs can duke it out for the 2nd pairing role.

everyone female doges and moans about wanting to see the kids and now that we are going to see the kids you are STILL finding a negative. we have been saying we need more high end talent and we got the 2nd pick in the draft and you are still finding a negative. we all complain about the Flyers' old way, while providing fun runs for the most part, but still not producing a championship so they bring in someone who spent time on the outside in Hextall (which people also female doged about the same old same old) who wants to change the way the team operates and you still find a negative. Yes there are still holes and no GM is perfect but Hextall has been reshaping this team and that takes time.

I mean, its this all just trolling for you?
- nastyflyergirl

Rhetorical question right?

Seriously, why hasn't Hexy dont it yet? Both players are the same age and have pretty much identical contracts commitment wise. Panthers didn't protect Demers and were trying to trade him around the expansion draft.
- mochoson

The two safest assumptions would be the term for Demers and FLA might not like AMac. Would have to imagine the fancy stats are still important to them even after what happened.

edit: third safest....they like AMac

While you are correct, I think it can be argued that Schenn's 17 (?) PP goals were benefit of system / players, especially when looking at his 5V5 production. I mean how many goals (when looking back) were "skilled" shots or difficult goals? I feel most of his goals came around the net via deflection, rebound, and getting in the dirty areas. With the new assistant coach and him having a highly successful PP, I don't think it will be as difficult to replace Schenn as you're making it out to be. On top of that, I expect our 2nd PP unit to improve which should also contribute some solid production (between new coach + better players) unlike previous seasons.
- arichardson22

You can argue it, but it's a flawed argument. How about Simmonds goals? What kind of goals are they? If what you state is true, I'm wondering how come there aren't more 25 goal, 50 point forwards in the NHL? Schenn brought skill and production the lineup, dismissing it on the points you made is a bad argument.

I'm just wondering if the offense will resemble Nashville with a lot of initiation from the dmen. Kind of hard generate offense with slow skaters like Schultz and Streit, or passive dman like AMAC. I'm really looking forward to training camp to see how the blue line shakes out and who is the top 6.
- ravishingone

It doesnt even have to be at the level of Nashville to work. Just need a more fluid group of 5 guys playing together at evens.

Schenn is an interesting case...I agree that 25 goal players are nothing to sneeze at and I have been been a supporter of his since he got to Philly. On the other hand, his lack of production at even-strength is a handicap of his that can't be discounted. His reliance on production on special teams means that he'll be prone to cold streaks when the PP inevitably goes cold throughout the course of a season. His production won't necessarily be easy to replace, but not impossible either and the opportunity to gain a couple of firsts for him, seemed to be a move of the GM selling high on him. I can't dislike the move all things considered.
- Sublime55

The entire team struggles at even strength last season. In 15/16 Schenn put up top 60 scoring numbers at ES. All of a sudden he's labeled as a handicap at ES. I agree that the return was something that couldn't be passed up and I'm not arguing against making the deal. Simply discounting the idea that he won't be missed and his production will be easy to replace.

It doesnt even have to be at the level of Nashville to work. Just need a more fluid group of 5 guys playing together at evens.
- YuenglingJagr

I like Gudas, but I doubt he sees the end of his contract with the Flyers with Sanheim, Myers, and Freedman the next wave of prospects after this current group filtering in this year. Hexy isn't averse to selling a guy high in his mind, the Schenn deal proves that. We ll see how Sanheim and Myers look in training camp to see how close they are to the NHL.

Whatever they do with the PK, I hope there is more opportunity created for SH goals. It's such an exciting play and makes other teams a little less confident on their power play, especially moving the puck across the top. Flyers were tied for 23rd in SHGs, while tied for 19th in PK%. It was so sad. They were also 3rd in SHGs against--EEP! While 7th in PPG but 14th in PP% (3rd in PP opportunities and 15th in times SHed, so the idea they are an undisciplined team breaks down a bit there, doesn't it?). But basically from sucky to mediocre on special teams.